Generational Theory Forum: The Fourth Turning Forum: A message board discussing generations and the Strauss Howe generational theory

(08-23-2021, 02:07 PM)John J. Xenakis Wrote: [ -> ]** 23-Aug-2021 World View: The FBI and the Staged Insurrection

(08-23-2021, 10:41 AM)David Horn Wrote: [ -> ]>   I reread the Reuters article, and have a hard time getting the
>   same "information" from it that you did.  The only thing that
>   seems to be off the table is seditious insurrection, because they
>   were too stupid to have more than a plan to break-in.  That hardly
>   makes them innocent (especially when you cite BLM protests as
>   models needing prosecution). There's still plenty there without
>   that, and a few of them will get years behind bars for their
>   trouble.  Some BLM protestors will too.

Did you read what you've written?  There's NO INSURRECTION!  The
"insurrection" WAS A HOAX perpetrated by your (vile word redacted)
pals in the Democrat party.

That makes about as much sense as saying that Roman Polanski staged the Tate-LaBianca murders by the Manson cult. Just because Roman Polanski was then capable of staging a convincing movie and has done some sleazy things since then does not mean that he would arrange some horrible murders. Maybe the vast majority of people in the Capitol building were snookered into what they considered a peaceful protest, taking the words of Donald Trump literally. They are that gullible. But there were some monstrously-vile deeds. Attacking police officers is an inexcusable crime. 

Illicit behavior that has gullibility or stupidity behind it often becomes catastrophe. 

Now here's what I can't understand: the counting of the electoral vote was a formality that usually gets little attention in the media because it simply ratifies what we know. It's ordinarily about as predictable as elections in Commie countries, which explains why American news media paid little attention to Commie elections.  

We all know that in accordance with law an election for President and Vice-President (and for many different public offices) was held on November 3, 2020, and in accordance with laws defining the procedure of the election and the count. If you dislike the result, then welcome to the club. Few people vote "right" in all elections and are satisfied with the results of all Presidential elections. If the riotous mob really had taken over the Capitol building long enough, then the official meeting of the electors could have taken place in some other place and still been official -- let us say a pro hockey rink or pro basketball court, a giant theater or concert hall (the Kennedy Center for Performing Arts), the Pentagon, or a giant college hall. A hint: the US Naval Academy is in Annapolis.         

Quote:It's not even clear that "trespassing" was a crime on January 6, since
the Capitol was/is open to the public, and Capitol police apparently
invited the protesters to enter the building.  If some people
illegally trespassed, or if they broke a couple of windows, then fine,
prosecute them, though they should be out on bail within a couple of
days.

Getting into a building contrary to authorization, going into a part of a building in which one is not authorized to go, or remaining in that building after one has no permission to stay there is burglary. About the only exceptions involve an assumption of permission (thus police doing an authorized raid on a drug den  or firefighters breaking into a house to rescue people or fight a fire  are not burglars even if they break in, and I wouldn't press charges on someone who broke into my house for shelter from a tornado.  

People have no right to disrupt a session of Congress or to do a partisan protest. A Black Lives Matter protest or a Gay Pride event would be at least as unlawful. The Capitol is the wrong place for the expression of partisan politics through shouting, parading, or introducing flags.  

I don't ordinarily predict the results of trials not yet completed, but in general, those who have more mitigating factors in their favor get off lightly if convicted. There's a wide variety of behavior, and those that do not involve security breaches or overt violence and did not organize the riot will get slaps on the wrist. 
  

Quote:But many of the so-called "insurrectionists" were simply standing
around on the Capitol steps or outside the building.  They committed
no crime whatsoever, except the crime of being Trump supporters, but
they've were thrown in jail for months, often in solitary confinement.
Compare that to the antifa-blm fascists who burned down buildings and
cars, but still walk free.

Simply standing on the steps? That would be innocuous.

Supporting Donald Trump is not a crime. People are still flying Trump banners and wearing MAGA caps in the rural county in which I live. I think it foolish, but people do plenty of stupid things, like smoking, getting drunk, failing to pay bills... 

Quote:So the next question is: Why did the Democrats leak the story about
"scant evidence"?  What was their motive?  Tucker Carlson has
investigated and believes that it was to prevent FBI agents in the
crowd from being identified.

There is plenty of evidence. Many participants had selfies of themselves at the event and transmitted them to friends. Some may have sent the selfies to their kids who were with the other spouse who has been subjected to domestic violence or has been getting child support less regularly than is mandated by a court decision. "Hey, Mommy! Daddy went to the Capitol in Washington and sent these pictures"... and she is stuck in some dump like Portsmouth, Ohio where she struggles to meet the bills.  Hello, FBI! One fellow, Olympic champion Klete Keller, wore his Olympic jacket into the Capitol... he was easy to identify. 

The Capitol Putsch is resoundingly unpopular in America. There will be people who claim after being misidentified that they were in Pittsburgh that day... and perhaps they were... to get on a plane to Baltimore or Washington. They may have rented a car, and rental cars have GPS on them. I expect rental-car companies to buckle about the movements of people who rented their vehicles when they get a court order to discuss the matter. It's much like financial records. People have ratted on participants. People have turned themselves in. 

Advice to anyone being grilled on participation in the event: DO NOT LIE. The FBI does not use the brutal methods that one associates with the Gestapo, KGB, or Mukhabarat. It doesn't need to beat an abject confession out of someone. Innocent people have nothing to lie about. Offenders have plenty to lie about. The FBI finds the liar and thus the offender.          

Quote:The January 6 show had a predecessor -- a 2020 hoax to accuse a group
of Trump supporters of trying to kidnap Michigan Gov. Gretchen
Whitmer.  It now turns out that the entire attempt was provoked by a
dozen FBI agents who had infiltrated the group and helped them plan
the entire plot.  The FBI was extremely embarrassed when the identity
of the FBI agents was revealed.

-- The group accused of plotting to kidnap Michigan Gov. Whitmer was
  riddled with FBI informants who took leading roles, according to
  BuzzFeed
https://www.insider.com/kidnapping-consp...ort-2021-7
(Insider.com, 21-Jul-2021)

Yup -- infiltrate (someone gets cold feet and talks to the FBI when so serious a crime as kidnapping or murder is possible) and pose as potential accomplices. Those who get cold feet become FBI assets and remain insiders, and the plot unravels just before something can go seriously wrong. Very often one of the participants is tricked into an illicit transaction involving a firearm or explosives.   

Quote:So Tucker Carlson believes that the "scant evidence" leak was used to
prevent the false accusations from going to trial, so that the FBI
agents in the January 6 hoax would not revealed.  This is entirely
plausible, in view of Whitmer kidnapping hoax.

There was no kidnapping of Governor Whitmer; the plot was thwarted. There is thus no hoax. Law enforcement did what it was supposed to do. This said, I have seen some of the reporting, and the participants seem like a bunch of real losers. 

Quote:-- Tucker Carlson sees coverup plot behind announcement FBI found
  little evidence of coordination among Jan. 6 demonstrators
https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/202...tors_.html
(American Thinker, 21-Aug-2021)

[/quote]

Tucker Carlson is not a credible source, and "The American Thinker"... well...

Quote:QUESTIONABLE SOURCE
A questionable source exhibits one or more of the following: extreme bias, consistent promotion of propaganda/conspiracies, poor or no sourcing to credible information, a complete lack of transparency, and/or is fake news. Fake News is the deliberate attempt to publish hoaxes and/or disinformation for profit or influence (Learn More). Sources listed in the Questionable Category may be very untrustworthy and should be fact-checked on a per-article basis. Please note sources on this list are not considered fake news unless specifically written in the reasoning section for that source. See all Questionable sources.

• Overall, we rate the American Thinker, Questionable based on extreme right-wing bias, promotion of conspiracy theories/pseudoscience, use of poor sources, and several failed fact checks.
  
  Detailed ReportReasoning: Conspiracy, Propaganda, Lack of Ownership Transparency, Failed Fact ChecksBias Rating: EXTREME RIGHTFactual Reporting: LOWCountry: USA (45/180 Press Freedom)Media Type: WebsiteTraffic/Popularity: High TrafficMBFC Credibility Rating: LOW CREDIBILITYDetailed ReportReasoning: Conspiracy, Propaganda, Lack of Ownership Transparency, Failed Fact ChecksBias Rating: EXTREME RIGHTFactual Reporting: LOWCountry: USA (45/180 Press Freedom)Media Type: WebsiteTraffic/Popularity: High TrafficMBFC Credibility Rating: LOW CREDIBILITYHistory
  

[b]History
[/b]
American Thinker is a conservative news and opinion blog founded in 2003 by Thomas Lifson (He frequently writes for the conspiracy site The Liberty Beacon) and Health Care consultant Richard Baehr (he also writes frequently for PJ Media, Jewish Policy Center, and Israel Hayom). Both Liftson and Baehr are Kenyon College Alumni. According to an interview with Richard Baehr, he originally launched the website as a forum: “I think we have one of the most thoughtful online forums out there,” Thomas Lifson is currently the Editor and Publisher of the site. 

Read our profile on the United States government and media.


Funded by / Ownership
The American Thinker does not disclose who owns the website. The website is funded through donations and online ads and offers an “ad-free experience for a small fee.” 

[b]Analysis / Bias
[/b]
American Thinker consists of two sections, one is articles, and the other one is a blog. You can check out their archives Here. 

In review, American Thinker uses strong emotionally loaded language in their headlines: “The Most Memorable Leftist Hypocrisies of 2017-8”. This article is authored by Robert Oscar Lopez, who writes with extremely biased language: “The left is composed of horrible people.  Most sane people realize this, even if they have friends on the dark side.” Another article with loaded wording is this one: “The Great Depression of 2019?” Although they utilize credible sources such as thebalance.com, CNBC, New York Times, The Guardian and factually mixed sources such as LifeZette, Wall Street Journal, Human Events.com, they also utilize questionable sources to back their claims, such as Breitbart and non-credible conservative blogs such as michaelsavage.com.  


According to the Southern Poverty Law Center, American Thinker has published Anti-LGBT articles and those by prominent white nationalist Jared Taylor. Further, American Thinker routinely publishes conspiracy theories, such as those by Pamela Geller, who is also on the SPLC’s hate watch list due to anti-Islam positions: Report: Obama said ‘I Am a Muslim,’ which has been debunked as a false claim. They have also promoted conspiracies about the Seth Rich Murder, and they have published numerous articles that are not supportive of the consensus of science, such as this one: The Hoax of ‘Climate Change.’

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/american-thinker/

It's just a blog. Blogs are not sources in their own right. 

(08-23-2021, 02:07 PM)John J. Xenakis Wrote: [ -> ]** 23-Aug-2021 World View: The FBI and the Staged Insurrection

(08-23-2021, 10:41 AM)David Horn Wrote: [ -> ]>   I reread the Reuters article, and have a hard time getting the same "information" from it that you did...

Did you read what you've written?  There's NO INSURRECTION!  The "insurrection" WAS A HOAX perpetrated by your asshole pals in the Democrat party.

It's not even clear that "trespassing" was a crime on January 6, since the Capitol was/is open to the public, and Capitol police apparently invited the protesters to enter the building.  If some people illegally trespassed, or if they broke a couple of windows, then fine, prosecute them, though they should be out on bail within a couple of days...

But you still seem to be capable of thought.  Why are you in league ith these evil people who are infiltrating peaceful protesters with
FBI agents?  And that's not all.  These people are implementing policies dictated by "the squad," who come from countries that hate
the United States and want to do everything possible to destroy the country.  They let criminals out of jail, they encourage blacks to
kill each other on the street, they flood the country with Covid-laden people from countries around the world, who flood the country with
enough fentynal to kill the entire population, they've turned energy-independent America into a country begging for energy, and now
we have the Afghanistan debacle which was implemented in the worst possible way.  These outcomes are not unintended consequences.
They're done on purpose to destroy the United States.  I can imagine AOC calling home every day and bragging that she's playing a big part
in destroying America.

Supporting these evil people makes you as evil as they are.  Why are you still supporting them?

John -- get help.  Seriously.  90% of this is fantasy (I snipped a lot of it, but left enough to make my point).  There are several excellent videos of the January 6th invasiion of the Capitol.  The one by the Washington Post is short but still excellent.  The 40-minute version by the NY Tiemses (taken from all sides of the Capitol and all available interiors) is even better.  And btw, most areas of the building are alwasy closed to the puiblic for obviousl reasons.

And your argument that the Democrats are destoying the public and getting them hooked on drugs is really a push.  Blame the Sacklers for that one.  Oh yeah, they're Republicans, fwiw.

(08-23-2021, 07:17 PM)John J. Xenakis Wrote: [ -> ]** 23-Aug-2021 World View: Insurrection by TV watching

(08-23-2021, 06:34 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: [ -> ]>   Were you part of the insurrection on Jan.6? I call it the
>   attempted Trump coup.

There was no insurrection on January 6.  However, I did watch the
staged insurrection hoax on TV, but please don't tell the Democrats,
because they may decide that it's "insurrectionist" merely to watch it
on TV, and they may start jailing such people.

It must be fun to live in your own disconnected reality. The proper criminals in this coup attempt/invasion are being rounded up just fine.

(08-24-2021, 10:36 AM)David Horn Wrote: [ -> ]

(08-23-2021, 02:07 PM)John J. Xenakis Wrote: [ -> ]** 23-Aug-2021 World View: The FBI and the Staged Insurrection

(08-23-2021, 10:41 AM)David Horn Wrote: [ -> ]>   I reread the Reuters article, and have a hard time getting the same "information" from it that you did...

Did you read what you've written?  There's NO INSURRECTION!  The "insurrection" WAS A HOAX perpetrated by your asshole pals in the Democrat party.

It's not even clear that "trespassing" was a crime on January 6, since the Capitol was/is open to the public, and Capitol police apparently invited the protesters to enter the building.  If some people illegally trespassed, or if they broke a couple of windows, then fine, prosecute them, though they should be out on bail within a couple of days...

But you still seem to be capable of thought.  Why are you in league ith these evil people who are infiltrating peaceful protesters with
FBI agents?  And that's not all.  These people are implementing policies dictated by "the squad," who come from countries that hate
the United States and want to do everything possible to destroy the country.  They let criminals out of jail, they encourage blacks to
kill each other on the street, they flood the country with Covid-laden people from countries around the world, who flood the country with
enough fentynal to kill the entire population, they've turned energy-independent America into a country begging for energy, and now
we have the Afghanistan debacle which was implemented in the worst possible way.  These outcomes are not unintended consequences.
They're done on purpose to destroy the United States.  I can imagine AOC calling home every day and bragging that she's playing a big part
in destroying America.

Supporting these evil people makes you as evil as they are.  Why are you still supporting them?

John -- get help.  Seriously.  90% of this is fantasy (I snipped a lot of it, but left enough to make my point).  There are several excellent videos of the January 6th invasion of the Capitol.  The one by the Washington Post is short but still excellent.  The 40-minute version by the NY Times (taken from all sides of the Capitol and all available interiors) is even better.  And btw, most areas of the building are alwasy closed to the puiblic for obvious reasons.

And your argument that the Democrats are destroying the public and getting them hooked on drugs is really a push.  Blame the Sacklers for that one.  Oh yeah, they're Republicans, fwiw.

Occam's razor typically shreds conspiracy stories. The Capitol Building was closed to the general public, and news media were there to record a planned formality that is usually anticlimax. The news story that everyone reasonably expected to appear on the network evening news channels was that a gavel would pound a wooden block, silence would begin, and someone would read the results. We all knew what those would be. 

Much of the news footage will not make it to broadcast. Much has already ended up in the custody of police and prosecutors. Some participanmts were foolish to implicate themselves by showing themselves at the scene.

Well, well, well. The first domino falls in the Michigan plot. It has taken nearly a year, and one of the participants got off lightly in what could have been a life sentence had the plot been initiated and even a federal death sentence had it resulted in the murder of the Governor of Michigan. 75 months (six years and three months) followed by three years of probation looks lenient for what he did. The first to rat on other conspirators usually gets by far the lightest sentence.

Posted here as well in some other threads because Mr. X trivialized the Michigan plot with an absurd denial.


The legal process can unfold with amazing... sloth. One pleads guilty to a felony to avoid even harder time, perhaps in return for lesser time in prison than others involved. 

Quote:A Michigan man who admitted taking part in an extremist group's plot to kidnap Gov. Gretchen Whitmer in retaliation for Covid restrictions was sentenced Wednesday to over six years in prison.


The man, Ty Garbin, 25, is the only person to have pleaded guilty out of the more than a dozen men facing state and federal charges stemming from the plot. Five of those charged in federal court pleaded not guilty and face trial in October.

U.S. District Judge Robert Jonker sentenced Garbin to 75 months in prison, followed by three years of probation, and a $2,500 fine.

During the sentencing hearing, Garbin apologized to Whitmer, who was not present.
"First, I would like to take this opportunity to apologize to Gov. Gretchen Whitmer and her family," he told the court. "I've had a lot of time to reflect on my actions, and I never realized what my actions would have caused to her, but also her family.
"I can't even begin to imagine the amount of stress and fear her family members felt because of my actions, and for that I'm truly sorry," he said.

Source: NBC News.

He has had ten months in which to reflect. At least he is young enough that he can make something out of himself. My suggestion to him: read... and read... and read. Contrition is a healthy thing.

** 25-Aug-2021 World View: Getting help

(08-24-2021, 10:36 AM)David Horn Wrote: [ -> ]> John -- get help. Seriously. 90% of this is fantasy (I snipped a
> lot of it, but left enough to make my point). There are several
> excellent videos of the January 6th invasion of the Capitol. The
> one by the Washington Post is short but still excellent. The
> 40-minute version by the NY Times (taken from all sides of the
> Capitol and all available interiors) is even better. And btw,
> most areas of the building are alwasy closed to the puiblic for
> obvious reasons.

> And your argument that the Democrats are destroying the public and
> getting them hooked on drugs is really a push. Blame the Sacklers
> for that one. Oh yeah, they're Republicans, fwiw.

As you say, parts of the Capitol are open to the public, and walking
through the Capitol is not a crime that should put you in jail for
months -- unless, of course, you're a Trump supporter. Occam's Razor
tells you that a trespasser is simply trespassing, not insurrecting.

Well, I got help. I doubled my meds. Then I doubled them again. I
called a psychologist. Then I called a psychiatrist. Then I called a
neurologist. Then I called another psychiatrist. Then I reviewed all
the news reports. I reviewed videos. I reviewed all the analyses.

And the answer came out the same. The videos and reports all showed
individual peaceful protesters. There was no "insurrection" on
January 6. That's your fantasy. You're the one with the fantasy. It
was a hoax staged by the Democrats with the use of FBI infiltration,
following the staged kidnapping hoax of Gov Whitmer, also using FBI
infiltration.

For anyone else reading this, I wrote a well-researched and
well-sourced in the article I posted a couple of days ago.

*** 23-Aug-2021 World View: The FBI and the Staged Insurrection
http://generational-theory.com/forum/thr...l#pid78443
http://gdxforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=63603#p63603

As for Brower, Horn and Meece, you people are like Adam Schiff. You
remember that jackass Adam Schiff, don't you? He lies every day.
Remember his ridiculous laughable lies during the Ukraine impeachment
hoax? Just like you three. You don't give a shit what you say.
You're just Democrat party trolls. You say what the Democrats tell
you to say. The Democrats say what Nancy Pelosi tells them to say.
Nancy Pelosi says what "The Squad" tells her today, and the girls in
"The Squad" hate America and undoubtedly are bragging to the people
back home how they sabotaging the country in policy after policy,
which makes them evil and you equally evil for supporting them. Every
single policy of the Democrats has the purpose of destroying the
country.

So you say that talking about the massive inflow of drugs across the
southern border is "really a push"? You three guys are total idiots.

-- Fentanyl seizures at U.S. southern border rise dramatically
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/immigra...y-n1272676
(NBC News, 29-Jun-2021)

And so, Brower, Horn and Meece, you three are total idiots, in
addition to being pathetic and evil. But, let's face it, you fit in
well with your president.

** 25-Aug-2021 World View: Whitmer kidnapping hoax

(08-25-2021, 09:08 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: [ -> ]> Well, well, well. The first domino falls in the Michigan plot. It
> has taken nearly a year, and one of the participants got off
> lightly in what could have been a life sentence had the plot been
> initiated and even a federal death sentence had it resulted in the
> murder of the Governor of Michigan. 75 months (six years and three
> months) followed by three years of probation looks lenient for
> what he did. The first to rat on other conspirators usually gets
> by far the lightest sentence.

I guess this is really hard for you to understand. In both the Whitmer
kidnapping hoax and the insurrection hoax, FBI informants were used to
entrap the participants, which is illegal. Stalin wouldn't hesitate
to put someone in jail if it was revealed that the KGB had committed
entrapment.

However, there was a big difference between the two cases. When the
Whitmer kidnapping hoax was prosecuted, the role of the FBI was
revealed, which was embarrassing to the FBI and prosecution, though it
isn't preventing them from sending the poor slob to jail for the crime
of being a Trump supporter. But in the insurrection hoax, the Justice
Dept. is dropping the charges, saying that there's "scant evidence."

Why did they leak the "scant evidence" claim? So that the case won't
be prosecuted and the FBI won't be embarrassed again by having their
role revealed, as they were in the Whitmer case.

I told you that last time. I know that it requires a higher reading
comprehension level than you have, but try reading what I've written a
few times so that it will sink in.

(08-25-2021, 09:24 PM)John J. Xenakis Wrote: [ -> ]** 25-Aug-2021 World View: Getting help

(08-24-2021, 10:36 AM)David Horn Wrote: [ -> ]>   John -- get help.  Seriously.  90% of this is fantasy (I snipped a
>   lot of it, but left enough to make my point).  There are several
>   excellent videos of the January 6th invasion of the Capitol.  The
>   one by the Washington Post is short but still excellent.  The
>   40-minute version by the NY Times (taken from all sides of the
>   Capitol and all available interiors) is even better.  And btw,
>   most areas of the building are alwasy closed to the puiblic for
>   obvious reasons.

>   And your argument that the Democrats are destroying the public and
>   getting them hooked on drugs is really a push.  Blame the Sacklers
>   for that one.  Oh yeah, they're Republicans, fwiw.

As you say, parts of the Capitol are open to the public, and walking
through the Capitol is not a crime that should put you in jail for
months -- unless, of course, you're a Trump supporter.  Occam's Razor
tells you that a trespasser is simply trespassing, not insurrecting.

It depends upon what is going on in the Capitol. If the vote is on naming a post office, then maybe we get to see it. If it is the CIA budget we obviously don't.   

The term "trespassing" typically involves entering real property without permission. Thus if someone takes a shortcut across my lawn that is technically trespassing.  I wouldn't make a stink about a child using my driveway as a shortcut to get to or from a school bus. On the other hand if someone crosses my property to do some damage, like to commit vandalism, I would certainly press charges for trespassing. With buildings (houses, barns, sheds, chicken coops, commercial establishments, houses of faith), rail cars, motor vehicles, boats, or aircraft entry with the intention of committing a crime is burglary. An open door to a business is something that we all understand. This said, if one stays after the business is closed or enters store rooms generally closed to the public one is committing burglary. The people who entered the Capitol building without obvious consent were technically burglars. 

I have visited the Capitol three times: in 1967 (with my parents), and twice in the 1970's (on the way to a band festival). The Capitol is awesome. It is a place of reverence for what has gone on there. Law defines the United States as a political order, and short of life-saving in medicine or military service in defense of my country I can imagine no more important responsibility in work than to make the law, vote on the law, or assist in its design. Emancipation Proclamation, establishment of National Parks,. declarations of war, ratification of treaties, the GI Bill, enacting the Interstate Highway program, the Civil Rights and Voting Rights Acts, the Americans with Disabilities Act... it was all done there. Not in some cavern about which nobody knows. Ratifying the results of the Electoral College is a standard ceremony that rarely draws attention of the media, but this time people in the Capitol made a mockery by trying to undo the results of an election that went as they didn't like. Most of us experience that half the time or so. Some never get it right because they vote for Parties or Candidates who have no meaningful chance. 

I didn't see any BLACK LIVES MATTER banners. I saw no rainbow (LGBT) flags. I saw nobody with an image of Che Guevara, Vladimir Lenin, Mao Zedong, or other commies. I did see Trump banners which do not belong in the Capitol. I did see some Confederate flags. 

I heard someone shout "HANG MIKE PENCE!", which would be extremely disgusting if it came from my side.          

Quote:Well, I got help.  I doubled my meds.  Then I doubled them again.  I
called a psychologist.  Then I called a psychiatrist.  Then I called a
neurologist.  Then I called another psychiatrist.  Then I reviewed all
the news reports.  I reviewed videos.  I reviewed all the analyses.

You could not have done that; I think you are too smart. To put it as delicately as I can, the physician that you should have seen is a proctologist.  

Quote:And the answer came out the same.  The videos and reports all showed
individual peaceful protesters.  There was no "insurrection" on
January 6.  That's your fantasy.  You're the one with the fantasy.  It
was a hoax staged by the Democrats with the use of FBI infiltration,
following the staged kidnapping hoax of Gov Whitmer, also using FBI
infiltration.

Peaceful protesters?  Peaceful protesters are the sorts who take a camera-wielding cell phone with them, perhaps expecting to document police brutality and instead end up documenting riotous acts. Should I get video of someone torching a police car, then that video goes to law enforcement or prosecution.  
   

Quote:As for Brower, Horn and Meece, you people are like Adam Schiff.  You
remember that jackass Adam Schiff, don't you?  He lies every day.
Remember his ridiculous laughable lies during the Ukraine impeachment
hoax?  Just like you three.  You don't give a shit what you say.
You're just Democrat party trolls.  You say what the Democrats tell
you to say.  The Democrats say what Nancy Pelosi tells them to say.
Nancy Pelosi says what "The Squad" tells her today, and the girls in
"The Squad" hate America and undoubtedly are bragging to the people
back home how they sabotaging the country in policy after policy,
which makes them evil and you equally evil for supporting them.  Every
single policy of the Democrats has the purpose of destroying the
country.

If you consider  a tiger's tail a leg, then how many legs does the usual tiger have? Four. No matter what you say, a tail is not a leg. 

I have had arguments with people who called the Holocaust the "Holohoax". So I explain all the solid evidence from eyewitness testimony from perpetrators, survivors, bystanders, and liberators. I show that Jewish populations once large virtually disappeared. People might have appeared in Censuses as Jews or might have been identified in some way that suggests that they were Jewish (as in having Yiddish as one's first language in Poland or Ladino -- an archaic Spanish close to the original language in which Cervantes used in writing Don Quixote) in Greek. The Dutch re-opened synagogues to such Jews as would return for worship. About 90% of Dutch Jews were exterminated. Before the war the Netherlands was a good place in which to be a Jew. It would be again. I mentioned evidence put into criminal trials of perpetrators -- orders, requisitions, personnel records, payrolls, accounting ledgers, and death lists. One of the nastiest of the Nazis, Ernst Kaltenbrunner, denied that the initials on damning evidence were his. He did not deny the reality of the documents calling for murders. 

So what do I get for denouncing the Holocaust deniers? I get called a "dirty Jew" who "sees gentiles as goyim" Heck, I am likely descended from some families, parts of which went to the New World and parts of which stayed in Germany around 1750... and the descendants of some of those who stayed probably were major Nazi war criminals. My mother's maiden name is the same as some Hungarian general of German origin (he Magyarized his name at some point) who was convicted by Yugoslavia for major war crimes. yes, he was guilty. I have ancestors named Hess (as in Rudolf) and Funk (as in Walter, the President of the Reichsbank who fenced  the loot such as wedding rings, gold teeth, gold eyeglass frames, cash and currency, and other treasures) from murdered Jews.  Sure, I hate Nazis. It is impossible to be a good person these days and not hate Nazis. I told that Nazi sympathizer that if I had to choose between being a Jew and a Nazi I would choose Judaism because as a Jew I would have fewer cultural or moral compromises to make.     

So you say that talking about the massive inflow of drugs across the
southern border is "really a push"?  You three guys are total idiots.

Quote:-- Fentanyl seizures at U.S. southern border rise dramatically
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/immigra...y-n1272676
(NBC News, 29-Jun-2021)

And so, Brower, Horn and Meece, you three are total idiots, in
addition to being pathetic and evil.  But, let's face it, you fit in
well with your president.

FCUK fentanyl. 

(08-25-2021, 09:46 PM)John J. Xenakis Wrote: [ -> ]** 25-Aug-2021 World View: Whitmer kidnapping hoax

(08-25-2021, 09:08 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: [ -> ]>   Well, well, well. The first domino falls in the Michigan plot. It
>   has taken nearly a year, and one of the participants got off
>   lightly in what could have been a life sentence had the plot been
>   initiated and even a federal death sentence had it resulted in the
>   murder of the Governor of Michigan. 75 months (six years and three
>   months) followed by three years of probation looks lenient for
>   what he did. The first to rat on other conspirators usually gets
>   by far the lightest sentence.


I guess this is really hard for you to understand.  In both the Whitmer
kidnapping hoax and the insurrection hoax, FBI informants were used to
entrap the participants, which is illegal.  Stalin wouldn't hesitate
to put someone in jail if it was revealed that the KGB had committed
entrapment.

It isn't a hoax if it is genuine. Unless you want to claim that the FBI beats confessions out of people (which would have had to happen during both the Trump and Biden administrations) as did the Gestapo or the KGB... it was simply good police work. The FBI technique is to ask a few questions and find out which answers are lies. Innocent people typically rush to the prosecutor if some suspicion falls upon them so that they can clear themselves. Guilty people must lie to keep presenting themselves as innocent. They typically piole one lie upon another to protect the first lie -- that one is not the criminal slimeball that the cops are looking for.

To the question of what he would most want to teach a boy (this was back when girls were rarely criminals, and J. Edgar was a male chauvinist):

Quote:Above all, I would teach him to tell the truth Truth-telling, I have found, is the key to responsible citizenship. The thousands of criminals I have seen in 40 years of law enforcement have had one thing in common: Every single one was a liar.

J. Edgar Hoover

  To be sure, not every liar is a criminal, but in general the criminals are all liars. Truth is far simpler than a damnable lie. 

Consider this scenario. A rape suspect is asked whether he was ever at (XXXX) where a rape was committed. The FBI has already dusted the Venetian blinds to find finger prints, as the victim recalled that the rapist went to the blind and peered through it as he heard a siren. The rapist put his hands on the Venetian blinds and thus his fingerprints. An FBI Special Agent asked the suspect whether he ever was at XXXX, where the rape was committed. If he was never there he was not the rapist. But if his fingerprints are to be found on the Venetian blind, then his claim to have never been at XXX has disintegrated.

I can't tell you what the line of questioning was. The kid probably lied about a bunch of stuff. like whether he had had contact with others in the plot, whether he had been certain places, whether he played with is toys (in the Militia movement, firearms). From what I recall neighbors heard much gunfire and knew that this fellow and his associates were involved in anti-government activities. Well, the FBI wasn't looking for stamp collectors, was it? 

At some point he realizes that he is up $#!+ Creek without a paddle. 75 months or 40 years? If it is 40 years he will leave prison a broken old man... and prison ages people fast... with nowhere to go and no way of restarting his life. 75 months? He will have family support again. Maybe he will get the opportunity to do farm labor when he can still do it. One does not want to leave prison capable only of doing white-collar work at age 65.  

From what I understand, neighbors squealed first. The FBI sought to disrupt the plot. I don't care how many agents it took. So what is the disruption? One establishes fake intimacy and listens for hints. You know --  here's where we can buy guns. We have been scouting the vacation residence of the Governor. 

It's ironic, isn't it? I have compared the Capitol Push to the Bolsheviks storing the Winter Palace in Petrograd in 1917... and kidnapping the Governor of Michigan looks much like the plot to sequester Mikhail Gorbachev in 1991. Good God!     

Quote:However, there was a big difference between the two cases.  When the
Whitmer kidnapping hoax was prosecuted, the role of the FBI was
revealed, which was embarrassing to the FBI and prosecution, though it
isn't preventing them from sending the poor slob to jail for the crime
of being a Trump supporter.  But in the insurrection hoax, the Justice
Dept. is dropping the charges, saying that there's "scant evidence."

Since when is it illegal to be a Trump supporter? Doing a crime in the support of a political figure is a crime. President Trump hated Governor Whitmer for contradicting him on COVID-19. Contradicting the Great and Infallible Leader of the Empire of Northern Korea is good for a death sentence for oneself and ones family. That's not how things work here. Thank God and our Founding Fathers!

He has pled guilty to felony charges. Those are not all shown, but I would guess that those include conspiracy and weapons charges. 

This is a more detailed description of the old allegations:

Quote:Those six suspects facing federal charges in the alleged kidnapping plot used encrypted messaging to communicate about the plot, conducted coordinated surveillance on the governor's vacation home and detonated an improvised explosive device wrapped with shrapnel, officials said.
Based on court documents, the FBI was well aware of the activities of the six men charged and there does not seem to have been an imminent threat posed to Whitmer.

The documents identify the defendants as Adam Fox, Barry Croft, Ty Garbin, Kaleb Franks, Daniel Harris and Brandon Caserta.

At a meeting in July, allegedly attended and recorded by one of the informants, the men “discussed attacking a Michigan State Police facility, and in a separate conversation after the meeting, Garbin suggested shooting up the governor’s vacation home," authorities said.

Then at a July 27 meeting, Fox and an informant discussed a possible kidnapping of Whitmer, with the defendant allegedly saying: “Snatch and grab, man. Grab the f---ing governor. Just grab the b----. Because at that point, we do that, dude — it’s over.”

"Fox said that after kidnapping the governor, the group would remove her to a secure location in Wisconsin for 'trial'," according to the criminal complaint.

The alleged conspirators used code words and encrypted platforms to shield their discussions from authorities, according to U.S. Attorney Andrew Birge for the Western District of Michigan.


They used terms such as "cake" or "cupcakes" for bombs, a "chemistry set" for components of an improvised explosive device and "baker" for an explosives manufacturer, according to the complaint.


"Fox and Croft in particular ... discussed detonating explosive devices to divert police from the area of the (governor's vacation) home," Birge said.

The federal investigation involved at least one member of a Michigan militia group who was involved in a Second Amendment rally at the Michigan Statehouse in June.

That member allegedly told the FBI that the group was considering killing police officers and agreed to become an informant.


But the involvement of that militia in the plot to kidnap the governor appears to be minimal as the group that was charged Thursday allegedly discussed keeping the broader militia out of their actual plan.

In a YouTube video from May, Caserta claimed in a 30-minute diatribe that “the enemy is government.” He shot the video in front of an anarchist’s flag and a map of Michigan.

....

The alleged conspirators used code words and encrypted platforms to shield their discussions from authorities, according to U.S. Attorney Andrew Birge for the Western District of Michigan.

They used terms such as "cake" or "cupcakes" for bombs, a "chemistry set" for components of an improvised explosive device and "baker" for an explosives manufacturer, according to the complaint.

"Fox and Croft in particular ... discussed detonating explosive devices to divert police from the area of the (governor's vacation) home," Birge said.

The federal investigation involved at least one member of a Michigan militia group who was involved in a Second Amendment rally at the Michigan Statehouse in June.

That member allegedly told the FBI that the group was considering killing police officers and agreed to become an informant.


But the involvement of that militia in the plot to kidnap the governor appears to be minimal as the group that was charged Thursday allegedly discussed keeping the broader militia out of their actual plan.

In a YouTube video from May, Caserta claimed in a 30-minute diatribe that “the enemy is government.” He shot the video in front of an anarchist’s flag and a map of Michigan.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/six-men-charged-alleged-plot-kidnap-michigan-gov-gretchen-whitmer-n1242622

Nice stuff, huh? They even came up with cryptic language for the necessary segments of the terrorist plot. 

Quote:Why did they leak the "scant evidence" claim?  So that the case won't
be prosecuted and the FBI won't be embarrassed again by having their
role revealed, as they were in the Whitmer case.

I told you that last time.  I know that it requires a higher reading
comprehension level than you have, but try reading what I've written a
few times so that it will sink in.

Many of the people who illegally ente4red the Capitol Building did little. I expect many of those in the Capitol during the Putsch will get off lightly. Those who attacked police, threatened harm to elected officials and their staffs, or breached classified information will be in deep trouble. If they simply went to the Capitol in response to what President Trump told them to do, they might get off lightly.    

(08-25-2021, 09:24 PM)John J. Xenakis Wrote: [ -> ]** 25-Aug-2021 World View: Getting help

As for Brower, Horn and Meece, you people are like Adam Schiff.  You remember that jackass Adam Schiff, don't you?  He lies every day.  Remember his ridiculous laughable lies during the Ukraine impeachment hoax?  Just like you three.  You don't give a shit what you say.  You're just Democrat party trolls.  You say what the Democrats tell you to say.  The Democrats say what Nancy Pelosi tells them to say.  Nancy Pelosi says what "The Squad" tells her today, and the girls in "The Squad" hate America and undoubtedly are bragging to the people back home how they sabotaging the country in policy after policy, which makes them evil and you equally evil for supporting them.  Every single policy of the Democrats has the purpose of destroying the country.

The extortion of the Ukrainian President was witnessed by many and beyond dispute. Where, exactly, is the hoax?

more from John Wrote:So you say that talking about the massive inflow of drugs across the southern border is "really a push"?  You three guys are total idiots.  

-- Fentanyl seizures at U.S. southern border rise dramatically
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/immigra...y-n1272676
(NBC News, 29-Jun-2021)

H-m-m-m. Yes, the Chinese (primarily though there are others) are creating cheap fentanyl analogues and the Mexican cartels are bring them in. You do understand that a pound of fentanyl is roughly the equivalent of 1,000 to 10,000 pounds of morphine. It's easy to smuggle.

even more from John Wrote:And so, Brower, Horn and Meece, you three are total idiots, in addition to being pathetic and evil.  But, let's face it, you fit in well with your president.

At least we're fact based, unlike yourself.

** 26-Aug-2021 World View: The Gathering Storm in Afghanistan

President Joe Biden seems more confused and lost every day.

VP Kamala Harris has been cackling in Vietnam, saying platitudes.

Secretary of State Antony Blinken has been providing numbers and
narratives to reassure the public, but he looks like a deer caught in
the headlights.

Jen Psaki is the Baghdad Bob of the Biden administration. She'll say
any idiotic thing.

According to polls, 76% of the public say that the evacuation has been
going badly or very badly. Biden's approval rating has plummeted
quickly, to 41%.

It's obvious that Biden is annoyed. He doesn't want to have to deal
with this problem. It's too complicated for him to understand. He's
really furious that the mainstream media aren't simply covering for
him. He's tried several times to go on vacation during this crisis,
but was forced by events to stay in the White House. He just wants to
return to the safety of his bunker in Delaware.

The Democrats' strategy is to hope that a month or two from now,
Afghanistan and the Americans left behind, tortured, raped or killed
by the Taliban or by ISIS-K will be forgotten by the American public.

However, it's not that simple. I and probably others have the feeling
of a "Gathering Storm," to use Churchill's phrase. There are tens of
thousands people to be evacuated -- Americans, people with special
immigrant visa (SIV), Afghans who helped Americans, including
translators, spotters, drivers, or did any number of other tasks that
made the jobs of our soldiers possible, girl-women activists. Biden
has committed to withdraw all of these people by August 31, but nobody
believes that's possible.

This morning there were at least two explosions just outside the Kabul
airport. At this writing, the number of casualties has not been
reported. Update: At least 13 people have been killed.

It's believed that the explosions were the responsibility with ISIS-K,
which wants to sabotage the evacuation effort, and embarrass both the
Americans and the Taliban, who have been cooperating.

For the time being, the airlift out of Kabul airport has been halted.
A Pentagon briefing is expected soon.

** 26-Aug-2021 World View: Ashli Babbitt's killer comes forward

(08-26-2021, 09:20 AM)David Horn Wrote: [ -> ]> The extortion of the Ukrainian President was witnessed by many and
> beyond dispute. Where, exactly, is the hoax?

I've explained all this to you before, but I know you suffer from
memory lapses, so I'll try again.

Unlike you, I actually watched the Ukraine hearings. Adam Schiff who
lied on a daily basis, made up a phony transcript of a phone call
between Trump and Ukraine's president. Trump was then able to release
the actual transcript, making Schiff look like a piece of garbage, but
that never stopped him.

During the Ukraine hearings, every witness was forced to recant his
testimony under cross examination by the Republicans. But the
mainstream media lied about that every day, reporting "explosive
testimony."

The star witness, Ambassador Gordon Sondland originally said that
Schiff was wrong, but Oregon Democratic Rep. Earl Blumenauer incited
violence against Sondland's family and business, and he was forced to
change his testimony. However, the truth came out under Republican
cross-examination.

Jonathan Turley's family was also threatened with violence by
Democrats when he testified that the impeachment couldn't be
justified. Turley was proved right, when the whole case collapsed in
the Senate. So the whole Ukraine thing was a lie and a hoax.

Please make a note of the above, so I don't have to explain it to you
again.

(08-26-2021, 09:20 AM)David Horn Wrote: [ -> ]> H-m-m-m. Yes, the Chinese (primarily though there are others) are
> creating cheap fentanyl analogues and the Mexican cartels are
> bring them in. You do understand that a pound of fentanyl is
> roughly the equivalent of 1,000 to 10,000 pounds of morphine. It's
> easy to smuggle.

So we agree.

(08-26-2021, 09:20 AM)David Horn Wrote: [ -> ]> At least we're fact based, unlike yourself.

You're full of crap. You look at youtube videos and declare a
peaceful protest to be an "insurrection". You're not stating facts.
You're a sock puppet for Nancy Pelosi and Adam Schiff.

By the way, here's an amusing fact. I don't know much about this, but
apparently there are thousands of hours of video taken during the
so-called "insurrection" in the possession of the FBI that they're
refusing to release. It's believed that this video shows that the FBI
is guilty, especially now that there is "scant evidence" of an
insurrection by peaceful Trump supporters.

One more amusing fact. We know that Lt. Michael Leroy Byrd, a black
officer of the Capitol police, on the staff of Nancy Pelosi, is the
man who murdered Ashli Babbitt, the young girl who was killed for
being a Trump supporter, as she climbed through a broken window.
However, Byrd's name has never been officially released.

So now Byrd himself has come forward, and is going to be interviewed
on MSNBC tomorrow. Presumably he'll paint himself as the hero that
saved democracy from a dangerous woman who supports Trump.

** 26-Aug-2021 World View: Kabul airport bombing

Four US marines were killed, and three were wounded in the bombing at
the Kabul airport.

At least 30 people are confirmed dead, including women and children.

(08-26-2021, 12:12 PM)John J. Xenakis Wrote: [ -> ]** 26-Aug-2021 World View: Kabul airport bombing

Four US marines were killed, and three were wounded in the bombing at the Kabul airport.

At least 30 people are confirmed dead, including women and children.

Truly sad but fully predictable.  What's less predictable is how we will respond ... or the Taliban for that matter.

(08-26-2021, 11:21 AM)John J. Xenakis Wrote: [ -> ]** 26-Aug-2021 World View: Ashli Babbitt's killer comes forward

(08-26-2021, 09:20 AM)David Horn Wrote: [ -> ]>   The extortion of the Ukrainian President was witnessed by many and beyond dispute. Where, exactly, is the hoax?

I've explained all this to you before, but I know you suffer from memory lapses, so I'll try again.

Unlike you, I actually watched the Ukraine hearings.  Adam Schiff who lied on a daily basis, made up a phony transcript of a phone call between Trump and Ukraine's president.  Trump was then able to release the actual transcript, making Schiff look like a piece of garbage, but that never stopped him.

During the Ukraine hearings, every witness was forced to recant his testimony under cross examination by the Republicans.  But the
mainstream media lied about that every day, reporting "explosive testimony."

The star witness, Ambassador Gordon Sondland originally said that Schiff was wrong, but Oregon Democratic Rep. Earl Blumenauer incited violence against Sondland's family and business, and he was forced to change his testimony.  However, the truth came out under Republican cross-examination.

Jonathan Turley's family was also threatened with violence by Democrats when he testified that the impeachment couldn't be justified.  Turley was proved right, when the whole case collapsed in the Senate.  So the whole Ukraine thing was a lie and a hoax.

Please make a note of the above, so I don't have to explain it to you again.

Did we watch the same hearings?  I assume you used the Fox feed.  I used the NBC feed.  Mine had no testimony breaks in it, and nothing I heard squares with what you just wrote.  Nothing.

even more from John Wrote:

David Horn Wrote:>   At least we're fact based, unlike yourself.

You're full of crap.  You look at youtube videos and declare a peaceful protest to be an "insurrection".  You're not stating facts.  You're a sock puppet for Nancy Pelosi and Adam Schiff.

By the way, here's an amusing fact.  I don't know much about this, but apparently there are thousands of hours of video taken during the so-called "insurrection" in the possession of the FBI that they're refusing to release.  It's believed that this video shows that the FBI is guilty, especially now that there is "scant evidence" of an insurrection by peaceful Trump supporters.

I saw cops being beaten, forced entry to the Capitol while it was in session, and your "peaceful tourists" on the floor of the House and Senate and elsewhere "peacful tourists" are specifically barred from being. That's all undeniable.  I assume the video the FBI has is being kept as evidence with a proper chain of custody.  So no, you don't get to see it until the trials are over ... except for what will be presented as evidence.

** 26-Aug-2021 World View: Ukraine quid pro quo

shoshin Wrote:> John, you have an.odd definition of "recant." When the Republican
> puppets on the committee asked the witnesses if Donald Trump
> actually said " I'll deliver those weapons if you dig up dirt on
> Biden," they had to respond (being under oath) " No, not those
> words." Bur everyone in that room, and everyone watching, and
> everyone who listened to the call knew EXACTLY what he meant. But
> don't believe your lying ears and eyes.

My eyes and ears saw and heard the entire hearing, and my eyes and
ears were not lying, and have never lied. What you've written above
is total nonsense, so it's you that have no idea what was going on.
In fact, I interpret your statement about "knew EXACTLY" as an
admission that you're purposely lying about what happened. Or maybe
your eyes and ears are the liars. Or maybe it's just your mouth.
This is typical of left-wing Democrats.

Here's what I posted on December 3, 2019:

Quote:> "I've been saying for years that a new American Civil
> War is impossible, and I still believe that to be true, but I've
> definitely been shaken up by the impeachment hearings.

> I actually listened to the five days of public testimony live. I
> don't know how many people are going to read this posting, but I
> doubt that any one of them besides myself did that.

> It was very depressing, because after each day's testimony, I
> would listen to the news on the BBC or Al-Jazeera or MS-NBC later,
> and the news reports bore absolutely no relationship to what
> actually happened. They were total lies -- and I know this
> because I saw and heard it with my own eyes.

> Every single witness was forced to admit under Republican
> cross-examination that they had no evidence whatsoever to support
> Adam Schiff's charges. It was all made up. It was all garbage.
> But every single news report lied about it, saying something like
> "Today, Ambassador X gave explosive testimony that Trump withheld
> aid from Ukraine until Ukraine started investigating Joe and
> Hunter Biden." In fact, all the news reports used the same words,
> indicating that they were all reading the same press releases from
> Adam Schiff and the Democrats.

> Nothing even remotely close to that ever occurred. The Republican
> cross-examination forced every single witness to admit that there
> was no evidence for a "quid pro quo" of any kind. It's a total
> fabrication and fantasy.

> You should be aware that everything you've heard about the
> impeachment hearings is completely wrong, because everything
> you've heard is Adam Schiff talking points, provided by the
> Democrats. That's all the mainstream media quotes. If you want
> to hear the other side, a good source is Hannity at 9pm ET on Fox.

> The star witness, Gordon Sondland, originally said that there was
> no qpq [quid pro quo] in the bunker hearings. Then he changed his
> testimony in public to say that there was a qpq. Then under
> cross-examination in the public hearing, he was forced to admit
> there there was no evidence of a qpq.

> Why did he change his testimony? Because his family was being
> threatened with violence and his businesses were the targets of
> riots and demonstrations. These threats and riots were being
> organized by Democrats to force Sondland to change his testimony.
> And it worked, because he was forced to change his testimony, to
> keep his family from being killed or his businesses from being
> destroyed. Even so, under Republican cross-examination, he was
> forced to go back to his original position.

> These threats of violence on Sondland's family and businesses are
> being led by Adam Schiff, who has lied and manufactured evidence
> dozens of times in the last three years. He is the worst piece of
> lying garbage on the scene today -- which is saying something,
> because there's a lot of garbage today on the scene in Washington.
> And it says a lot that the Democrats are being led by this
> worthless peace of garbage. It says a lot about them."

It came out in news reports later that the violence against Sondland
was incited by Oregon Democrat Rep. Earl Blumenauer. Perhaps he
was encouraged by the Democrat party witch, Maxine Waters, who has
repeatedly incited violence against Republicans.

Later, Jonathan Turley's family was also threatened with violence by
Democrats when he testified that the impeachment couldn't be
justified.

So the whole Ukraine impeachment circus was a lie and a hoax. It
joins other events that turned out to be hoaxes -- the Gov Whitmer
kidnapping hoax and the insurrection hoax. Both of those hoaxes were
staged with the help of FBI agents who infiltrated and entrapped the
Trump supporters by encouraging them or even planning with them.

So those are three hoaxes staged under the direction of Nancy Pelosi
and Adam Schiff. That makes a grand slam.

(08-26-2021, 11:21 AM)John J. Xenakis Wrote: [ -> ]** 26-Aug-2021 World View: Ashli Babbitt's killer comes forward

(08-26-2021, 09:20 AM)David Horn Wrote: [ -> ]>   The extortion of the Ukrainian President was witnessed by many and
>   beyond dispute. Where, exactly, is the hoax?

I've explained all this to you before, but I know you suffer from
memory lapses, so I'll try again.

Unlike you, I actually watched the Ukraine hearings.  Adam Schiff who
lied on a daily basis, made up a phony transcript of a phone call
between Trump and Ukraine's president.  Trump was then able to release
the actual transcript, making Schiff look like a piece of garbage, but
that never stopped him.

Your assumption is that Donald Trump is the definitive truth because he is Donald Trump. Trump is an inveterate, pathological, self-serving liar. He is in the league of people who say things such as "Are you going to believe me or your lying eyes?".  No. Truth is a personal choice, and it is not an attribute of a person. It is at most a habit, one to be cultivated.

If one uses Donald Trump as the definition of truth, then just about everyone is a liar. Using Donald Trump as the definitive truth is like using a lunatic as a definition of sanity. Do you know one of the best tests of insanity? The insane consider themselves normal and normal people insane!

"Actual transcript"... huh? It could be a forgery, including a redaction that changes the meaning.      

Quote:During the Ukraine hearings, every witness was forced to recant his
testimony under cross examination by the Republicans.  But the
mainstream media lied about that every day, reporting "explosive
testimony."

Not what I recall. 

Quote:The star witness, Ambassador Gordon Sondland originally said that
Schiff was wrong, but Oregon Democratic Rep. Earl Blumenauer incited
violence against Sondland's family and business, and he was forced to
change his testimony.  However, the truth came out under Republican
cross-examination.

Sondland was basically a political appointee, and he knew little about diplomacy except as on-the-job training. His testimony was ambiguous. He was in the thankless position of having to serve two masters (the professional diplomatic corps and Donald Trump). Maybe if Trump didn't micromanage stuff in which he was incompetent and weren't so personally corrupt we would have had no first impeachment. 

Blackmailing a foreign leader to do dirty work in American partisan politics is simply inexcusable. Trump had to be impeached even if such would be awkward for Democrats.    

Quote:Jonathan Turley's family was also threatened with violence by
Democrats when he testified that the impeachment couldn't be
justified. Turley was proved right, when the whole case collapsed in

the Senate.  So the whole Ukraine thing was a lie and a hoax.

 
As often appears in Wikipedia, [[citation needed]].

That the impeachment vote went almost completely along partisan lines demonstrates something other than vindication of President Trump.

Quote:

(08-26-2021, 09:20 AM)David Horn Wrote: [ -> ]>   H-m-m-m. Yes, the Chinese (primarily though there are others) are
>   creating cheap fentanyl analogues and the Mexican cartels are
>   bring them in. You do understand that a pound of fentanyl is
>   roughly the equivalent of 1,000 to 10,000 pounds of morphine. It's
>   easy to smuggle.

So we agree.

(08-26-2021, 09:20 AM)David Horn Wrote: [ -> ]>   At least we're fact based, unlike yourself.

You're full of crap.  You look at youtube videos and declare a
peaceful protest to be an "insurrection".  You're not stating facts.
You're a sock puppet for Nancy Pelosi and Adam Schiff.

Am I to trust you, Mr. X, or "my lying eyes"? I have been at or by peaceful demonstrations, and I know what they look like. The Capitol Putsch looks like a peaceful demonstration about as much as a cat overpowering a mouse looks like an expression of kindness toward the mouse.  

Quote:By the way, here's an amusing fact.  I don't know much about this, but
apparently there are thousands of hours of video taken during the
so-called "insurrection" in the possession of the FBI that they're
refusing to release.  It's believed that this video shows that the FBI
is guilty, especially now that there is "scant evidence" of an
insurrection by peaceful Trump supporters.

Embargoed for use by federal prosecutors in criminal prosedcutions.  

Quote:One more amusing fact.  We know that Lt. Michael Leroy Byrd, a black
officer of the Capitol police, on the staff of Nancy Pelosi, is the
man who murdered Ashli Babbitt, the young girl who was killed for
being a Trump supporter, as she climbed through a broken window.
However, Byrd's name has never been officially released.

Ashli Babbitt is not the "innocent young girl" as you depict her. She was 39, so she was old enough to have teen-age children, and she was using military techniques to breach a defended perimeter. Use military techniques in the violation of the law and you are anything but innocent. She transmitted video that suggested that she knew what she was doing all along. 

Quote:So now Byrd himself has come forward, and is going to be interviewed
on MSNBC tomorrow.  Presumably he'll paint himself as the hero that
saved democracy from a dangerous woman who supports Trump.

You leave out some critical details. Multitudes still support Donald Trump without doing crime to back their support. 

People simply milling around in the capitol building, I predict, will get slap-on-the-wrist sentences. They will get probation and fines, perhaps community service, and end up on a no-fly list and lose their passports. To be sure, ending up on a no-fly list practically ensures the end of some careers such as traveling salesmen and auditors. Bye-bye, CPA career.

Thank goodness for my hero, Adam Schiff, standing up for democracy and against the American tyrant Trump.

** 27-Aug-2021 World View: Enabling and trolling for Adam Schiff

(08-27-2021, 04:38 AM)Eric the Green Wrote: [ -> ]> Thank goodness for my hero, Adam Schiff, standing up for democracy
> and against the American tyrant Trump.

Schiff is lucky to have you, and you will be useful to him as time
goes by.

As I've written in the past, the worst people in the world are the
leaders that order their armies to commit genocide, war crimes, ethnic
cleansing, atrocities, and crimes against humanity -- people like
Adolf Hitler, Mao Zedong, Pol Pot, Robert Mugabe, Josef Stalin, Xi
Jinping, and Bashar al-Assad. These people were very popular, and won
elections. They had to be popular in order to get away with their
horrific crimes.

The Democrats are not yet committing full-scale genocide, but they've
been conducting full-scale massacres of blacks in the last century
through the KKK and this century through street crime. Adam Schiff is
becoming a leader in making those massacres possible, as well as other
crimes.

Right behind them, the second-worst people, are people like you, the
people who are supporting the criminals -- the enablers, the excusers,
the deniers, the collaborators, the acolytes and the trolls -- the
people who defend the war criminals and make the actions of Hitler,
Mao, Stalin and al-Assad possible. These are the people that make
genocide and war crimes possible, and they are as much to blame as the
war criminals themselves.

The Democrat regime is becoming increasingly Fascist and Stalinist.
Adam Schiff will be looking for opportunities to attain leadership
positions in this growing Fascist organization, and he'll call on
people like you to help him. I assume that you've already signed up,
but if you haven't yet, you should do so.

What a collection of delusional verbiage!